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Tree Line DS Or DS'ing good front sides in the reverse Wind

Started by wdeighton, August 04, 2012, 19:05:58 pm

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wdeighton

Need a thread about this.
Quite a bit going round the world but I dont think much in the UK.
So these vids are added to give some Ideas and perspective

Tracer Tree DS

wdeighton

The Germans Showing how to do it.

Fischbach Kinetic 100 DP 249mph

And a bit more information from http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=22218674&postcount=1296
"Hello Spencer and Joe
Thank you for your congratulations.
The front side of Fischbach has about 20 degrees, which is fine with the rubber, the top of the hill is a small row of trees is because you can even keep up with the Kinetic a few seconds.
I think that the limit on the Hill is located at 260 -270 mph.
But better than no hills.
What I was really surprised, the landing was sort of easy,
The Kinetic has only just begun to run when the wind goes over 40 mph, including other models are equally fast or faster.
We have more wind is up at 70 kmh gusts usually only short
and exactly fit into this small window has everything.
The Flitschengummi is emc vega.de the mega rubber,
because you can shoot models to high-22kg.
We have taken the 4 pieces you draw from less than 300%
You can take off the rubber is 900%.

have a nice day
jochen"

What sites have you got around you that may work?
What model would you use?
Thinking the D60 could be good

Surprised about how far forward they are putting the hook.

deckit

Steve 'Hobster' Hobday has certainly done treeline DS at a spot in the Midlands.

As to DSing our regular edged frontside sites in reciprocal winds, Kiwi Steve & I tried at Treakcliff with the wind dead-on but the 'backside' was horrible.
Though we didn't have any real momentum at entry as we couldn't use my bungee as intended, couldn't find a patch of ground which would take the screw anchor. So it's worth another go.

Reckon the ideal tool for such forays would be an electric motor powered Mini Dragon, or similar.
Only needs enough power to gain initial height for a worthwhile entry.

Or maybe an Alula & hand catapult :D


wdeighton

Quote from: deckit on August 04, 2012, 19:36:14 pm
Steve 'Hobster' Hobday has certainly done treeline DS at a spot in the Midlands.



Too True, I had forgotten about that.
That site works in the very seldom south east, and is a bit like borough, no it makes borough look good. bat that range. Maybe like Burton dasets south west slope.

But it has never been tried with a catapult launch and a heavier model.

Maybe that would be a place to try but I think the people and heather may get in the way.

Will

hobster

Alex appears to be DSing a completely flat site with only a thin row of trees. Just looking at the site, I would never have guessed it would work so well.

I found some candidate sites a while back nr to me (north Leics) but they always require access to farmers' fields so never pursued further.

For an electric DS machine, I think the MCT would be a good candidate. As you know it was originally designed as a hotliner - for old school brushed motors. Subsequently it will take a large diameter cheapy outrunner (40mm should be no problem). Hobbyking do an NTM motor with about 1.3kw + on a 5s or 6s for just over 20 quid! Shouldn't be too difficult to make a similar fuz to supplement the OEM glider fuz  ;). However, even a folded prop creates a fair amount of drag..

deckit

Can't disagree with that, Steve, & hope you give it a go! :af

I was thinking more in terms of a machine suited to exploratory work.
Don't think I'd wish to risk an MCT on a potential site.
Alex seems to have more in way of bravery & skill, 3m mouldies don't come cheap......

wdeighton

Quote from: deckit on August 04, 2012, 23:36:16 pm
Can't disagree with that, Steve, & hope you give it a go! :af

I was thinking more in terms of a machine suited to exploratory work.
Don't think I'd wish to risk an MCT on a potential site.
Alex seems to have more in way of bravery & skill, 3m mouldies don't come cheap......


Its a bit like the Andy Bourne approach to DS.
He went out and bought a D80, Because if you wand to be good, start with the right tools.

a 3m mouldi is very efficient, and if rigged up correctly could have a good response and be good at teaching you the the circuit, but may have a low limit.
But in line with Deckit, If you hit some turbulence, it could get very broken.

I have my eye on a couple of sites, also in the farm lands, with some kind of front side to help. Now just need some balls.

thermaled

Have done a fair bit of tree line ds, its just the same as normal dsing except you stand at a different place. When looking for places that might work imagine the top of the tree line is the hill, if its on a bit of a brow or a nice slope with clean wind and the treeline is reasonably dense it will probably work ok. I have always used a bungy to gain height, it gives you one shot at it, mess it up and you need to do a quick landing and try again, (or climb the tree to retrieve your model). Mouldies have worked much better than foamies for me, so guess its a bit of a high risk strategy unless you are building your own.
       I have one particular site which I think will work well, even without the trees there, but launching is a bit of a challenge. An electric assisted launch with some get out of trouble power would be handy there, and built this glider   http://rcspeeds.com/aircraftdetails.aspx?AC=323   with the idea of keeping the fuselage chunky to take a motor and be able to try out places like that. My current one is around 45ozs, so fairly chunky for a 45" wingspan. A lighter built fuse would easily carry the motor and lipo so must try it sometime. Shame I got zero interest in that plane, was quite keen to sell a few as thought it had some potential.

wdeighton

Quote from: thermaled on August 05, 2012, 16:49:00 pm
An electric assisted launch with some get out of trouble power would be handy there, and built this glider   http://rcspeeds.com/aircraftdetails.aspx?AC=323   with the idea of keeping the fuselage chunky to take a motor and be able to try out places like that. My current one is around 45ozs, so fairly chunky for a 45" wingspan. A lighter built fuse would easily carry the motor and lipo so must try it sometime. Shame I got zero interest in that plane, was quite keen to sell a few as thought it had some potential.


How Much where you thinking Mark? I never realised that you where interested in producing to sell.

thermaled

Short kit £75.00 for a solid, coloured epoxy glass fuselage and cnc cut foam cores

Fuselage with carbon bagged wing and stab, fitted together with surfaces hinged ect  £175

Elevator servo fits in the tail under a hatch,  nose is not completely round though, more squarish with rounded corners but should work well electified, and is where the rk40 section originated. Wings are taped on so can take a lot of punishment. Thanks for the interest and sorry for getting off topic, better pm me if you want to know more or can start a new thread if there is some interest.



deckit

Quote from: thermaled on August 06, 2012, 16:21:28 pm
Short kit £75.00 for a solid, coloured epoxy glass fuselage and cnc cut foam cores

Fuselage with carbon bagged wing and stab, fitted together with surfaces hinged ect  £175

Elevator servo fits in the tail under a hatch,  nose is not completely round though, more squarish with rounded corners but should work well electified, and is where the rk40 section originated. Wings are taped on so can take a lot of punishment. Thanks for the interest and sorry for getting off topic, better pm me if you want to know more or can start a new thread if there is some interest.


Very interesting development, why not a dedicated thread?
Great to see some Brit homebuild DS machines  :uk:

SpeedsterDEN

More treeline DS.
Tree line Dynamic soaring with 2 Trinitus 3,2 meter F3b gliders at Sæby modelflyveklub Denmark.
6 M/sek, 12 knots wind.
30 feet from the RC clubs runway. :)
Towed to 150 feet by a Funcup, and then the fun begin  :af
Tree line DS.
Dynamic soaring will change your life..

SpeedsterDEN

More about the treeline DS
For a while we had talked about whether it would be possible to fly dynamic soaring behind the row of trees standing 30 feet from the runway at our RC club
And Wednesday the wind was in the right direction and we gave it a shot.
It went better than expected.
The Trinitus 3,2 meter F3b gliders was towed to around 150 feet
Only 12 knots wind

This evening we did 6 DS flights from 5 to 17 minutes.  :)

If you want to try it, it will require a quick and good glider.
And if you will try, first go behind the trees, and if there is lee and no turbolens, it shold be possible.
Here there was not much turbolens, much less than expected and it was easy to fly the line compared to the a windy day at my small DS dunes.
Before I tryed with the glider,  I tested the circle with the Funcup  ;)

Next time I try with my Arthobby Termik and Valenta Destiny.

RC glider, treeline DS.
Cheers
S
Dynamic soaring will change your life..

thermaled

Nice flying. I have struggled to keep up the speed when dsing trees on  flat ground like in your video, about 10 circuits is my best so far so more practice I guess but you obviously have the hang of it. Had much better success with sites where there is a slope involved, not  a big hill but either a bit of a slope before the trees to give the wind a more upward gradient, or the ground falling away behind the trees to keep below the shear for longer, having both makes for a great site to fly but harder to find. 

SpeedsterDEN

Today I did 1 hour 26 min. 07 sek in termal with my Arthobby Termik  :)
at rc club and smash my old (and the club record) with 21 min.
:)
But yesterday I had a little different fun with the AH Termik and the wind and trees at the club.
Not much wind, but it gave some laps in the small gusts.

Tree line Ds, Arthobby Termik

Regards
S
Dynamic soaring will change your life..

deckit

Quote from: SpeedsterDEN on August 26, 2012, 20:28:37 pm
Today I did 1 hour 26 min. 07 sek in termal with my Arthobby Termik  :)
at rc club and smash my old (and the club record) with 21 min.
:)
But yesterday I had a little different fun with the AH Termik and the wind and trees at the club.
Not much wind, but it gave some laps in the small gusts.

Tree line Ds, Arthobby Termik

Regards
S


Nice flying, S, you were certainly digging deep into the back!
All that sandune practice..... :)

SpeedsterDEN

Dynamic soaring will change your life..

SpeedsterDEN

Dynamic soaring will change your life..

SpeedsterDEN

Dynamic soaring will change your life..

hobster

Hi Soren, your last post just has #Invalid YouTube Link#  $%&

The Saint. (Owen)

Electrickery is the work of the devil.
Proper aeroplanes are powered by engines.